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Legislative Assembly for the ACT: 2001 Week 8 Hansard (9 August) . . Page.. 2728 ..

MR SPEAKER: There is no point of order, but go on.

Mr Berry: I have not said anything yet.

MR SPEAKER: That is my comment from the chair.

Mr Berry: Okay. I don't mind people referring to the substantive motion. I raised some concern about it earlier and somebody said, "Well, the words 'dishonest denial' are in the motion." But the motion does not contain the word "lie". If you want the people over there to elevate the issue along those lines, I am sure that there is a more-

Mrs Burke: You are not going to belittle this, Mr Berry.

Mr Humphries: What is the difference between "dishonest denial" and-

MR SPEAKER: Order! Mr Berry has the call.

Mr Berry: Your usual course, Mr Speaker, is to stick to the substance of the substantive motion rather than let people stray all over the place with different forms of description which might suit their blood pressure at the time. So, Mr Speaker, what I ask you to do is make people stick to the words which are contained in the substantive motion.

MR SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr Berry.

Mr Hargreaves: Mr Speaker, I do not want to debate this issue, but Mr Smyth just inferred that Mr Stanhope had told a lie, that Mr Stanhope had refused to withdraw something. Mr Speaker, you did not ask him to withdraw anything, neither did the Assembly. If Mr Smyth is going to talk about this sort of thing, I ask him to at least get the facts straight. Mr Speaker, I ask you to uphold the point of order.

MR SPEAKER: Thank you, Mr Hargreaves. I say again that I am not going to get involved in these matters. That is what brought this on in the first place. I am asking the member of the government who made the comments referred to by Mr Hargreaves to withdraw them now.

Mr Moore: On the point of order, Mr Speaker: we do not use the term "lies" except in a substantive motion. This is the very thing that we are debating now.

MR SPEAKER: Order! I am tired of this and I am sure that most other members are as well. House of Representatives Practice states:

Although a charge or reflection upon the character or conduct of a Member may be made by a substantive motion, in expressing that charge or reflection a Member may not use unparliamentary words.

If you have used unparliamentary words, withdraw immediately.

MR SMYTH: Mr Speaker, I withdraw.

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